CAIR Goes After Christian Evangelist Franklin Graham~Video

Yesterday the Council on American Islamic Relations whined about Congressional candidate Lynne Torgerson and her views on Islam. Today the crybabies of CAIR have targeted Christian evangelist Franklin Graham for stating that true Islam cannot be practiced here as it contradicts our laws. Obviously CAIR does not like the truth.

The Council on American-Islamic Relations (CAIR) said it has received a number of complaints from concerned Muslims who watched an interview last night on CNN during which Graham stated in part: “…we have many Muslims that live in this country. But true Islam cannot be practiced in this country. You can’t beat your wife. You cannot murder your children if you think they’ve committed adultery or something like that, which they do practice in these other countries…I don’t agree with the teachings of Islam and I find it to be a very violent religion.”

Here is just one example.

Reliance of the Traveller
A Classic Manual of Islamic Sacred Law

APOSTASY FROM ISLAM

O8.1 When a person who has reached puberty and is sane voluntarily apostatizes from Islam, he deserves to be killed.

The beauty of this is that every day there are more and more of us and CAIR will not be able to keep up with us. Sorry CAIR, within the law your organization and Islam will lose!

Comments

comments

135 comments for “CAIR Goes After Christian Evangelist Franklin Graham~Video

  1. Dan
    December 12, 2009 at 6:39 pm

    I also find Islam a very violent religion, devoid of any positive force for humanity whatsoever. I'll stick with good old peaceful Christianity. Next time I see a witch I will kill her, next time my son argues with me I'll take him to the gates of the city and have him stoned to death. I'll start hating my parents and throw everything I own into the sea. I'll stop making fun of bald people lest a giant she-bear rips me to pieces. Next good looking young woman I see I'll belt her over the head and rape her, that way I'll get to marry her and never divorce her and be well taken care of in my dotage. Mind you, if I tire of her, I'll just wait until she wears clothes of two different cloths and stone the bitch to death. Yes, Christianity will do me.

    • December 12, 2009 at 6:48 pm

      Next time Christians are on a worldwide movement looking to subjugate the world under a set of barbaric religious laws let me know. Islam is a worldwide threat, and bringing up Christianity is pointless.

      • Dan
        December 12, 2009 at 6:56 pm

        All religion is pointless. It robs us of responsibility and reason.

        • December 12, 2009 at 7:01 pm

          At least 70% of the country identifies themselves as Christians. So all of them are not responsible people? Got it.

          Christians are not on a worldwide jihad. So there is no point in bringing them up.

          Happy Holidays!

          • Dan
            December 12, 2009 at 7:07 pm

            No point? Oh, sorry, I thought this Graham fellow was Christian.

          • December 12, 2009 at 7:10 pm

            Yes, no point as Graham is not looking to impose religious laws on the land. Try reality.

            Funny how you try to get to focus off of Islam….

          • Dan
            December 12, 2009 at 10:08 pm

            The point I make about theology being useless in fighting Islam needs no further proof than the struggle the Jews have been having for hundreds of years. Of course it's desirable to have as many Christians mobilised against Islam as possible but just being Christian, being convinced that all we need is strong belief in the Christian god in order to defeat Islam is erroneous at best. All Christians, Jews, atheists, Hindus et al need to unite under a secular, non partisan banner and concentrate on what the real issue here is, the totalitarian political nature of Islam.

        • Tony
          December 13, 2009 at 4:40 pm

          You are living in a Atheistic make believe world with no real knowledge about Christianity at all. Becoming a Christian means becoming the most reasonable and responsible person a human can be. The exact opposite of what you believe to be true.

    • Tom
      December 12, 2009 at 6:49 pm

      Dan, The Bible does not encourage or order anybody to do those things you describe. However, the Koran does encourage and order it's followers to kill others. Obfuscate and rationalize it all that you like, the only one you are BSing is yourself.

      • Dan
        December 12, 2009 at 11:55 am

        Tom, where do you think I found this stuff? It’s all in the Bible. Time the World rid itself of bronze age myths, learned to think for itself and moved on.

        • December 12, 2009 at 7:02 pm

          The Bible is a bunch of stories for those times. The Koran is for all time.

    • Jim
      December 13, 2009 at 12:31 am

      Dan, how about a little research first. All your stories are from the Old Testament. That would be Judaism. Start with one of the New Testament gospels, Matthew, Mark, Luke or John.

      • Dan
        December 13, 2009 at 12:40 am

        Oh, you really don't want me to do that Jim.

        • Nick
          December 12, 2009 at 7:05 pm

          If you believe that Islam is pointless, since it robs Muslims of responsibility and reason, then just say so.

          After all Islam is the topic currently under discussion.

          If you want to bash Christianity I suggest you visit Richard Dawkins’ site.

    • December 13, 2009 at 4:16 am

      Dan doesn't seem to follow any context in the Bible or he would know that over the ages there were different dispensations in which things were carried out. In one or a few dispensations it was not uncommon for God to pass immediate judgment on people who cursed him. they would fall over dead after shaking their fists at him. It's a good thing Dan lives in the age of grace, or he'd be long dead by now. Forgive him Father, for Dan knows not what he does. 🙂

      • Dan
        December 13, 2009 at 4:25 am

        OK, let's all just 'pray' Islam away.

        • December 13, 2009 at 4:31 am

          Point out where Rapture Forums said the only answer to the Islamic problem is prayers. You come off as a big time Christian hater, and you are bashing people that I have known for awhile. People that you know nothing about. Many of them are Christians that fully understand the issue and how to approach it.

          • Dan
            December 13, 2009 at 4:41 am

            All of them are Christians it would seem. I would never be so arrogant. I have no problem with any person's belief. I also have no problem in challenging any person's belief. That's what makes us free.

          • December 13, 2009 at 4:45 am

            1.You are being arrogant.
            2. This site is about the Islamic threat, not challenging Christians. Especially Christians that are on the same side in this issue.

    • December 13, 2009 at 4:18 am

      Dan, were you by chance a Christian once upon a time..?

      • Dan
        December 13, 2009 at 4:24 am

        No, like you and everyone else on the planet, I was born an atheist. Unlike most though, I resisted indoctrination and learned to think for myself.

        • December 13, 2009 at 4:29 am

          Keep bashing Christians, that should really help unite people. Amazing.

          • Dan
            December 13, 2009 at 4:38 am

            I'm only answering questions.

        • December 14, 2009 at 12:44 am

          Dan, I ask the question because most who resent Christianity tend to have been one before, so it's apparent you hate all religion which is a naive and bigoted approach. The fight is not between muslims and Non-muslims, but between those who value freedom and those who do not, you see, Xtianity doesn't seek to impose its will on us by force. Another point you miss is the value of religion in general, I have never seen athieism offer hope to the hopeless. Bottom line is, F.Graham made a passing comment on islam and a certain country where it dominates, there were no comparisons made, no counter from a religious perspective, yet you've chosen to attack the messenger merely on the grounds of his religion…

          • Dan
            December 14, 2009 at 2:17 am

            Resent? Hate? Naive? Bigoted? Provide any credible scientific or factually reliable evidence for the existence of god, gods or the supernatural and I'll no longer be an atheist. Can you say the same thing? Atheism is simply a lack of belief. You are an atheist when it comes to every other religion apart from Christianity. I just go one religion further. Everything I have said about Christianity can be proven with the Bible but as usual Christians dismiss parts of the Bible they find awkward to deal with. Some even totally disavow the entire old testament even though Jesus himself said that he came to fulfil the 'old law' and not replace it. You speak of the value of religion in general and how Christianity doesn't seek to impose it's will on us by force, well apart from the fact that religion is responsible for more death than both World Wars, what about the concept of hell? Hell didn't exist in scripture until Jesus came along and gave us the choice to believe or burn forever. Some choice eh?

          • December 14, 2009 at 2:26 am

            Either you are going to stop acting like an attention craved 5 year old and stop trying to hijack the thread everyday, or you will not be posting here. Stay on topic.

          • Dan
            December 14, 2009 at 2:41 am

            Christopher, take whatever action you deem necessary but don't tell me what I can or cannot say. If I'm not allowed to defend my position rationally against someone who insults me personally then I fear I am among the very same type of people who would rob us of our freedoms.

          • December 14, 2009 at 2:50 am

            Actually I can tell what to say or not say here. I have been more than patient with you and you are nothing more than a childish distraction to a serious problem. Everyone else gets along and I would never try and tell them what to say, as there is mutual respect.

            YOU are the only problem in this thread and I have seen enough of you.

          • Dan
            December 14, 2009 at 3:10 am

            Everyone gets along as long as they are Christian. Warning against the use of theology against Islam in this struggle is not a distraction, it's critical to our chances of ever getting on top of the problem.

          • December 14, 2009 at 3:26 am

            You are paranoid with Christianity. Everyone gets along because of respect. A word you know nothing about.

            This is besides the fact we heard you 100 times.

          • Nick
            December 13, 2009 at 9:54 pm

            Dan,

            We heard you already. You have not been “robbed of your freedoms”. You have been given plenty chances to put forward your point of view.

            You are also free to set up your own website, or to go to another one which promotes a purely secular viewpoint, such as Richard Dawkins’ site.

            Should you choose to go over there and try to “unite” your fellow atheists against Islam, you will fail. I know. They are not really interested in dealing with Islam. They only want to bash Christianity, and to promote the very political correctness you say is one of the worst problems we face today.

            If you don’t believe me just go over there and see for yourself. There’s an interesting thread there right now about Ayaan Hirsi Ali – read it. You’ll find that what I’m saying is correct, and your idea of not only uniting your fellow atheists, but Christians and other religious people too, under some banner designed by people like that – well, it’s a complete fantasy.

            As for Christians defeating Islam – when the Islamic armies of Sulieman the Magnificent invaded the island of Malta in 1565 it was the Knights of St. John along with the devoutly religious Maltese people who defended Malta, and so prevented Sulieman from doing what the Allies did in WWII – from Malta invading Sicily, from there Italy, and from there, mainland Europe. It is a plain historical fact that it took the belief, the inner steel, of those courageous Christians to defeat a vastly superior army, and keep Islam from overwhelming Europe.

            If you can give me a similar example of a force of atheists accomplishing a similar task at any point in history, I’d be very surprised indeed.

            So I put it to you that Christianity has indeed “defeated Islam” before now, and contrary to what you say, a purely “secular opposition” has, throughout all of history, not done so.

            Again: I suggest you visit Richard Dawkins’ site. You’ll find that your fellow atheists over there can’t agree on much of anything, and the vast majority of them are not interested in criticising Islam in any way – in fact they’ll do almost anything to avoid doing so, and to prevent others from doing so.

            But you will be able to criticise Christianity to your heart’s content. I suggest that site would be a better fit for you than this one.

    • Claudia
      December 13, 2009 at 5:37 am

      grow the hell up, just because you try to label other religions to be as bad as islam does not make islam any less violent and you show your debating skills to be lacking. Look for actual violence and there is only one offender.

      • Dan
        December 13, 2009 at 5:59 am

        Well since you brought it up, what motivates people to kill Doctors and blow up abortion clinics? Granted, Islam is far and away the most violent religion out there at the moment but don't pretend the logical pathway to violence in the name of god doesnt exist.

        • December 13, 2009 at 6:07 am

          Dan do not ever go into public relations, as you have no clue how to unite people. You just cannot keep your hatred of Christianity to yourself. Pointless, just pointless and immature that you just do not give a rest.

          • Dan
            December 13, 2009 at 6:21 am

            The point , as I've explained, is that Muslims claim to be victims of religious persecution and they use that against us. The only way to defeat Islam is recognise it for what it is and enact laws that prevent it's spread.

          • December 13, 2009 at 6:29 am

            "The only way to defeat Islam is recognise it for what it is and enact laws that prevent it's spread."

            We know that Dan and if you think you can get enough people to make that happen by bashing Christianity you are greatly mistaken. We know what we are doing, as the movement is growing here in America.

          • Dan
            December 13, 2009 at 6:54 am

            If Christianity could defeat Islam then I would be advocating a religious war but it can't and never will. I will continue to advocate secular opposition to Islam because that's the only thing that will work. I've already said that people of all faiths need to be mobilised but they must keep their personal beliefs to themselves if we are to have any hope of success. We live in the real World and our real leaders defer to Islam because of religious tolerance. I say put religion and political correctness behind us and move forward using reason and logic as our weapons. I see no good at all in publicly pronoting a particular belief system when the Muslims use that very thing against us. It may not make much difference to you what the Muslims bleat but it makes a hell of a difference in the greater public arena where religious tolerance is seen as important as the freedom of expression. We have to move away from the idea of religion v religion if we have any hope of influencing public opinion and focus on what Islam really is, a tyrannical, authoritarian ideology bent on removing these very freedoms we now enjoy.

          • December 13, 2009 at 7:03 am

            What the hell is wrong with you? No one is promoting anything. You don't live in the real world as you are not even smart enough to realize that no Christians will back someone like you. I see no good at all in your approach and you just cannot accept that we are going to dowhat we think is best. Our movement is growing and we will continue forward. A Christian leader whose family has MILLIONS of followers spoke the truth about Islam and you think the smart move is to bash Christianity. How ridiculous.

          • Dan
            December 13, 2009 at 7:28 am

            Nothing is wrong with me. I'll attack ridiculous ideas wherever I see them. You seem to overlook the fact I have always supported the idea of Christians and people of all faiths joining the struggle. If religious leaders like the Pope or the Archbishop of Canterbury were as honest about Islam as some of your religious leaders then of course the World would see Islam differently but alas, they never will and let's face it, these are the people with the real influence on the World's religious folk. It is indeed admirable that people like Graham and Falwell are speaking out against Islam and hopefully their followers will have a new perspective but rather than simply putting the case against Islam, they have to go that extra step and extoll the virtues of Christianity as well. I suppose that's their job but I don't think it's helpful.

          • December 13, 2009 at 7:32 am

            You seem to overlook the fact that asking Christians for help and then bashing them is flat out stupid.

          • Dan
            December 13, 2009 at 7:37 am

            I'm asking them to keep their beliefs private. Those who want to make silly claims will get an argument out of me, nothing wrong with that.

          • December 13, 2009 at 7:43 am

            Oh I see, but you can push your beliefs on everyone else, everything is you, you, you. Well you are not the most important person here. If you don't like what you read here, do NOT come here. You will also not hijack even one more thread here with this nonsense. That is a fact.

          • December 13, 2009 at 6:31 am

            Then Muslims will say that they are the victims of Fascism like they do in the UK. They will always complain. I personally do not care what they say, but you seem very sensitive to this.

          • Dan
            December 13, 2009 at 6:56 am

            See above.

    • David Steber
      December 13, 2009 at 7:35 am

      Dan, your lies are disgusting. May you reap what you sow.

    • Tony
      December 13, 2009 at 4:31 pm

      You have lost what little mind you ever had Dan. The killing of witches or anyone else was never taught by the Christ, and sinful man has not systematically hunted witches for over 300 years. Jesus Christ never taught that anyone should be stoned to death, in fact, he saved the life of an adulteress who was about to be stoned to death. Christianity teaches that every person should honor their father and their mother. The bear story is from the Old Testament, not the New. But perhaps the Lord will allow a catastrophe in your life for your mocking of Him, his Father, and the great prophets of God. Now, as for you belting a good looking woman over the head and raping her, well that just sounds like something you desire to do all the time. If you would leave your fantasy world which is filled with hatred of God, Christianity truly would do for you, but I'm not counting on that ever happening.

  2. December 12, 2009 at 6:39 pm

    Islam is terrified of the truth. The truth is not hate speech, the truth is not racism, the truth is not islamophobia

  3. December 12, 2009 at 7:46 pm

    Franklin Graham is right. What other commentors fail to recognize is that Islam is not just a religion, it is also a complete way of life including numerous "laws" which would be criminal or at least illegal in the United States. Using only the Quran as a source, here is a short list:

    1. Inequality of women: God charges you, concerning your children: to the male the like of the portion of two females. (Surah 4: 11) And call in to witness two witnesses, men; or if the two be not men, then one man and two women, such witnesses as you approve of, that if one of the two women errs the other will remind her. (Surah 2:282)
    2. Physical abuse of women: And those [women] you fear may be rebellious admonish; banish them to their couches, and beat them. (Surah 4:34)
    (Continued below)

  4. December 12, 2009 at 7:47 pm

    (Continued)
    3. Protection of children: O Prophet, when you divorce women, divorce them when they have reached their period . . . As for your women who have despaired of further menstruating, if you are in doubt, their period shall be three months, and those who have not menstruated as yet. (Emphasis added.) (Surah 65:1 – 4)
    4. Inequality of non-Muslims: Fight those who believe not in God and the Last Day and do not forbid what God and His Messenger have forbidden – such men as practice not the religion of truth, being of those who have been given the Book — until they pay the tribute [jizya] out of hand and have been humbled. (Surah 9:29)
    5. Cruel and abusive punishment: And the thief, male and female: cut off the hands of both, as a recompense for what they have earned, and a punishment exemplary from God. (Surah 5:38)
    6. Beheading captives: When you meet the unbelievers, smite their necks, then, when you have made wide slaughter among them, tie fast the bonds. (Surah 47:3)
    (Continued below)

  5. December 12, 2009 at 7:51 pm

    (Continued)
    7. Taking of hostages and booty: It is not for any Prophet to have prisoners until he make wide slaughter in the land . . . Eat of what you have taken as booty, such as is lawful and good. (Surah 8:70)
    8. Freedom of thought, including religion: [Hypocrites] wish that you should disbelieve as they disbelieve, and then you would be equal; therefore take not to yourselves friends of them, until they emigrate in the way of God; then, if they turn their backs, take them, and slay them wherever you find them. (Surah 4: 89)
    9. Intolerance of other religions: O believers, fight the unbelievers who are near to you, and let them find in you a harshness; and know that God is with the godfearing. (Surah 9:125)
    10. Separation of religion and politics: That which you serve, apart from Him, is nothing but names yourselves have named, you and your fathers; God has sent down no authority touching them. Judgment belongs only to God. (Surah 12:40)

    • December 12, 2009 at 11:44 pm

      Your keen insight is always appreciated Chris!

  6. Dan
    December 12, 2009 at 10:08 pm

    It's pointless attacking a Muslim's faith. Religion forms only a tiny part of Islam, the majority of it's tenets are directly aimed at us, the infidel, and how to crush our way of life and Impose Sharia on all of us. Islam knows what it wants and knows how to achieve it. They use our liberal values against us coming up with concepts such as Islamophobia and insisting there is another Crusade against them. Public opinion by and large is on the Muslims side at the moment, people like us are seen as irrelevant right wing loonies because the public at large is fed lies about Islamophobic Christians bent on stopping Muslims from worshipping their god. We really don't need to add any substance to these lies. I would call on all people opposed to Islam to express their opposition in terms that directly confront Islam's true nature and not on terms that attempt to discredit their form of worship.

    • December 12, 2009 at 10:13 pm

      Hi Dan,
      I don't care what they label me. They will always find something. I also disagree, the country is turning on Islam, because we keep pounding out the message.

      Happy holidays to you and your family!

      • Dan
        December 12, 2009 at 10:41 pm

        You would have seen the World-wide condemnation of the Swiss vote banning Minarets in that Country. Why was that do you think? Do you think that the World's leaders don't listen to their constituencies who you claim are turning against Islam or do you think it's possible these leaders recognise that their voters see that Minaret ban as an attack on religion? It's this idea of religious freedom that allows Islam a foot in our respective doors and political correctness that allows it to flourish. Keep pounding out the message by all means but let's not lose our focus. This is not a war of faith but of ideology.

        • Dan
          December 12, 2009 at 10:42 pm

          If the religious want to cling on to our shirt tails then fair enough, but they must keep their religious beliefs to themselves and move toward our mutual goal not with extolling the virtues of their particular brand of nonsense, but with clear, reasoned arguments that cut through the political correctness that's suffocating us. We must convince decision makers that the danger of Islam is very real from a political point of view, not a religious one, because that will never ever work.

          • December 12, 2009 at 10:50 pm

            Dan, no offense I have been doing this for years, I know what needs to be done.

            Have a good day!

          • Dan
            December 12, 2009 at 10:59 pm

            If you are relying on religious faith to stop Islam, you have already failed.

          • December 12, 2009 at 11:09 pm

            I am relying on more than one thing. I have thousands of readers and have been invited on numerous radio shows, so I am continue to keep on doing what I think is best.

            Take care.

          • Dan
            December 12, 2009 at 11:17 pm

            I hope you have seen my point.

          • December 12, 2009 at 11:33 pm

            I see having this same conversation with you over and over as pointless. Christian leaders that have MILLIONS of followers have started speaking out. That is what is needed as the overwhelming majority of my fellow countrymen are Christians.

          • Dan
            December 12, 2009 at 11:44 pm

            My point is lost on you. Good luck.

          • December 12, 2009 at 11:52 pm

            What is lost on you is that my following is growing, so I what I am doing is right. I don't need you telling me what to do over and over. You being threatened by Christianity is your problem.

            You bringing up Christianity is every Islamic thread is pointless and an unnecessary distraction. Reply if you like, I am done wasting time.

          • Dan
            December 13, 2009 at 12:19 am

            Christianity dosen't threaten me. Islam does. Closing your eyes to my simple point cannot be helpful.

          • Nick
            December 12, 2009 at 7:13 pm

            If Christianity poses no threat whatsoever to you and Islam does, then you really ought to try to prove your theory correct yourself – go on, there’s nothing stopping you – instead of repeating it like a little girl who hasn’t learned any manners yet. Off you go and prove your “point” correct. Head off to wherever your fellow atheists hang out and start uniting them. I can absolutely flat-out guarantee you that you won’t be able to unite such people to fight against Islam. If you don’t believe me, and you still want to talk about a religion that you admit poses no threat to you whatsoever, shoot on across to Richard Dawkins’ site and ply your trade there for a while. See how you get on. Good luck.

  7. December 13, 2009 at 12:28 am

    @Dan….One more for the sake of comedy….I made it this far without your advice and will continue to move forward. Just like in the FB thread, you are nothing but a distraction.

    End of conversation.

    • Dan
      December 13, 2009 at 12:48 am

      My first reply, you mean where I point out just a few of the horrors of Christianity? You aint seen nothing yet! Making the struggle against Islam a war between faiths is about as useful as an ashtray on a motorbike.

      • December 13, 2009 at 12:59 am

        Here is the deal, you are a waste of time and a childish distraction to a very serious problem. The Bible is made of stories for those times, and you will not hijack my site with your POINTLESS posts.

        You couldn't unite even a handful of people to stand against Islam. You are not even smart enough to see that you are bashing people whose help you need.

        Take your nonsense somewhere else.

        • Dan
          December 13, 2009 at 1:13 am

          I had no idea you were against free speech. If you had read my comments you would have seen that I agree we need people of all faiths united against Islam. My point is that faith alone will never defeat a totalitarian idology. You're reacting exactly like any theist would when their particular brand of bullshit is challenged. You become hostile and defensive and dismiss any argument that may challenge your beliefs. Well feel free. I will continue to push the line that Islam can only be defeated through secular means and I will be proven correct.

          • December 13, 2009 at 1:28 am

            I am not against free speech, I am against wasting time and that is what you are. Only a complete fool thinks that they are going to unite Christians while bashing Christianity. So lose the ego, as your networking skills are sorely lacking.

            My brand of BS, has plenty of support and I certainly do not need yours. You don't like what I do, don't come here. Very simple.

          • Dan
            December 13, 2009 at 1:59 am

            I have no desire to unite or lead anyone. I think your efforts are laudable, as are the efforts of every other champion of freedom. My only desire is to take away from the Muslims their most effective weapon against us thus far, our willingness to prove over and over again that this is not a struggle against Islamic totalitarianism but a religious conflict. The defenders of Islamification scour pages like these looking for evidence that proves their assertion that they are the victims of another Crusade, that they are merely trying to practise their religion and are being oppressed by other religions. Go ahead and unite Christians by all means but bear in mind that we need far better arguments than 'My brand of BS is better than your brand of BS'.

          • December 13, 2009 at 2:01 am

            That is not what I am doing, I am not trying to bring anyone to any religion.

          • Dan
            December 13, 2009 at 2:05 am

            Well that's good.

  8. Gary Rumain
    December 13, 2009 at 12:38 am

    Franklin Graham doesn't go far enough. He doesn't mention the arselifters' propensity to rob, rape, loot, steal etc. All sanctioned by pislam against infidels.

    In one day alone, Mahound broke 6 of the 10 commandments passed down by God to Moses. What sort of man would do this? The Antichrist. Certainly not a man of God. Mahound was a psychopathic fraud.

  9. Ben
    December 13, 2009 at 12:54 am

    Islam is not a religion, it is a way of life. That way of life is inter species predation. The religious component serves as a control mechanism. Refer to my blog post "Islam's Mercenary Mission".

    • Dan
      December 13, 2009 at 1:16 am

      Which is exactly why I say Islam can never be defeated by faith. It may well be defeated by the faithful, but through secular, reasoned argument, not by the promotion of one faith over another.

      • Ben
        December 13, 2009 at 3:28 am

        Father Butros Zakaria has a mission that is converting many Muslims to Christianity. That is a good thing, not a bad thing.

        Only 17% of Muslims have read the Koran in a language they can understand. If they are ignorant of the doctrines of Islam yet retain a sense of personal morality, they are susceptible to conversion.

        Breaking Allah's yoke of slavery is our best option. Without it, victory requires killing more than 1 billion Muslims. You can't hope to get popular support for that option!

        • Dan
          December 13, 2009 at 3:54 am

          This isn't a 'win hearts and minds' war. You won't convert a billion Muslims to Christianity even if you translate the Koran into a language that all Muslims understand. How do I know this? The bible is in a language everybody understands yet Christians are still Christian. Of the 17% of Muslims that have actually read the Koran, 100% of them are still Muslim. It's also true that most Christians have never read the bible either yet those who have are still Christian. I used to think that the best way to rid the World of religion was to make the religious actually read their holy books but that dosen't sem to work. Killing anyone is out of the question. So where does this leave us?

          • Ben
            December 13, 2009 at 5:40 am

            Islam is a predator. It can not convert to grazing. It can not be reformed. It will always be a deadly predator. Either we defeat it and eradicate it or it will defeat us.

            Western Civilization has lost its soul. Multiculturalism has taken its toll. Confidence has been replaced by white guilt.

            Islam has drive, motivation & momentum. We lack the requisite resolve. We fail to recognize it as a predatory –existential enemy. When we retaliate, it is with ineffective half measures.

            The certain outcome is defeat; the total and permanent loss of our liberty & prosperity; eternal slavery.

            The alternative is to defeat Islam: kill them or convert them. The former is possible but messy and inhumane, with extensive collateral damage. The latter is preferable in humanitarian terms. We need to induce mass apostasy on a scale sufficient to break the system so hat the apostates will not be killed or harrassed.

          • Dan
            December 13, 2009 at 6:15 am

            I suppose it's possible to convert a billion Muslims to Christianity (or at least as many as it would take to break the system so that apostates will not be killed or harassed) No argument there. It must therefore be possible to convert 2.1 billion Christians to Islam (or at least as many as it would take to let Islam be the dominant World religion). Or we could demand our leaders put in place laws that restrict Islamification in our society. It's already happening all over the World and in my view it's the cloak of religious freedom and political correctness that's allowing it.

          • Ben
            December 13, 2009 at 7:47 am

            Islam is a war cult, not a religion. At minimum, we must amend the Constitution to recognize that fact, close the Muslim institutions, denaturalize and deport the Muslims, closing our borders to Islamic entry.

            Unfortunately, that would do nothing to prevent attacks from Mexico & Canada and ships off shore. Eliminating Islam is an absolute necessity. there is no acceptable alternative.

  10. December 12, 2009 at 6:14 pm

    Dan..Hi you are giving me a headache ;-)…aside from that- you stated some great facts about Islam- but they get lost in your bringing other religions into it.

    Yes Franklin is Christian-But that is not the MAIN POINT in the post- everyone is something . The Point is WE- Buddhist Hindu Atheist Agnostic JEWS Christians are all realizing and UNITING and against the common threat to Humanity=ISLAM

    Because we are a FREE Diverse People at times are individual motivators come out.
    But Always the main issue is Stopping Islam
    Jewish may bring in Judaism
    Christian Christianity
    Atheist might mention in their Islamic commentaries all religion sucks lolzz

    Please do not focus on that. Focus on that We are all trying to stop the greatest threat to humanity since Hitler.

    I found the Franklins words interesting and though I do not follow him- I pulled out what JOINS us not what separates us..

    We can NOT stop Islam unless we join stop nit picking…I could care less if people belive Lindsey Lohan is G*D as long as they realize Islam is KILLING…and THEY ARE not killing me to believe in Lindsey ;-)Then I am good.

    Thanks Christopher Again another Informative Interesting Post!

    • Dan
      December 13, 2009 at 1:45 am

      I don't mind what motivates people to stand against Islam. I see a fatal flaw in using whatever motivates us as the tool against Islam. It's the notion of religious tolerance that is overwhelming us and allowing Islam to swallow us whole. Using religion as a tool against Islam will never work, it can't. Mobilising the religious and everyone else will. Using theistic arguments against Islam will never work. Using secular, well thought out, rational arguments against the totalitarian, world dominating ideology that is Islam will.

      • Dan
        December 13, 2009 at 2:02 am

        People of all faiths need to unite under the banner of secularism or Islam will win.

        • December 13, 2009 at 2:07 am

          You got that right Dan, the world should of learned just by what the Hindus have experienced with Islam. But as a whole the non-Islamic world does not want to face the harsh reality of Islam.

        • Nick
          December 12, 2009 at 7:08 pm

          Then on you go to Richard Dawkins’ website and start unitin’!

          Good luck with that btw. Let us know how you get on.

    • December 13, 2009 at 2:35 am

      Good post, my friend. We need to unite Christians, Jews, Hindus, and Atheists, etc. against Islam, but bashing either other does not help. We need to just focus on our common enemy.

  11. Lenin-McCarthy
    December 13, 2009 at 2:27 am

    Campell is a useful idiot!

  12. December 12, 2009 at 7:29 pm

    Dan, Christianity isn’t only faith. Christianity is also works. For example, the Catholic Church is very rich, and it puts all these riches in more than 300,000 Hospitals, Clinics, Colleges, Primary and Secondary Schools, Universities, Orphanages, Homes for the aged, Burn Centers. Besides that, the Catholic Church hires millions of workers to work in these institutions. Isn’t that nice? Did you know that the Catholic Church hires atheists to do good works?

    Jesus Christ said: “Cure the sick.” “Feed the hungry.” “Clothe the naked.” “Do good to those who persecute you.” “Pray for your enemies.” “Obey the Ten Commandments.” “Thou shalt not kill.” “Honor your father and mother.” “Thou shalt not steal.”

    Dan, despite our shortcomings, many of us Christians are doing a pretty good job. What do you think? Dan, what I would like to see is that atheists build just one hospital for the benefit of everyone. JUST ONE. Dan, may the Cause of all causes, the Prime Mover of everything in motion, bless you.

    And I wish to hell Muslims would stop killing “infidels” and even other Muslims. Islam is a killing machine that must be stopped before it destroys ALL HUMANITY. Dan, some Muslims are converting. Some of them are now doing Christian work.

    • Dan
      December 13, 2009 at 4:56 am

      Seems to me that my lack of belief offends you. I think it puts me in a unique position. I'm able to see all religion as utter nonsense. My take on Islam therefore can't be coloured with an alternative set of belief systems. I can call it for what it is without fear of being labeled a 'Crusader'. I can take the fight up to Islam without being ever accused of usurping their beliefs with mine. What I'm suggesting is fighting Islam from a secular point of view whatever one's particular beliefs are. It's the only way of assuring the victory of freedom (including the freedom to believe whatever you like) over the tyranny of Islam (which will outlaw any belief system outside of Islam)

      • December 13, 2009 at 5:04 am

        Your lack of respect for my Christian readers that are no threat and stand against Islam "offends" me. As for you I really do not care what you believe in. Your fear of being labeled leads you to bash Christianity and only divides.

        You are also talking about things that are not happening, as am not telling anyone to embrace any religion. So how about giving it a rest and lose your obsession with Christianity?

        • Dan
          December 13, 2009 at 5:17 am

          I was actually replying to Truth Detector. I have every respect for your Christian readers. I have absolutely no respect for Christianity or any other religious belief. It's the beliefs I challenge, never the people who hold them.

  13. Dan
    December 13, 2009 at 6:03 am

    Just one? OK, Medecins Sans Frontieres is a secular organisation doing what you would call Christian works all over the World. They are motivated by a love of humanity and nothing else.

  14. Steve Warner
    December 12, 2009 at 11:07 pm

    Allah is dogpoop. Mohammed sprang from a rat's anus. Islam is Satan.

  15. henri4
    December 13, 2009 at 6:53 am

    Message from France: how happy we are that US people are not the naïve and inconscious people we feared they are. It was a time (maybe the Carter's period) when we were desesparate about the future of your great nation. Yes, indeed islam is a shame for humanitty and civilised countries, now we agree with you!

    • December 13, 2009 at 6:57 am

      Hi Henri,
      We are in this together, stay strong and good luck over there!

  16. Dan
    December 13, 2009 at 6:54 am

    I know you're not about recruiting converts to Christianity, I know you're only concerned with the spread of Islam. All I'm doing is pointing out a weakness in our attack and I hope people can see that.

    • December 13, 2009 at 7:04 am

      All you are doing is creating a sideshow distraction.

      Good night.

      • Dan
        December 13, 2009 at 7:11 am

        Well we'll see won't we? If I'm wrong, explain the negative reaction to the Swiss minaret ban. I already have.

        • December 13, 2009 at 7:22 am

          The negative reaction is from the left andPC crowd. There will always be people against those that speak out against Islam. Big deal. You are more concerned about someone labeling you than the problem itself.

          What part of I am going to do what I think is best, do you not understand? You can stop repeating yourself now. We have heard you over and over.

          • Dan
            December 13, 2009 at 7:34 am

            The whole World is PC, left and right, that's the problem. You don't get it. I don't care what I'm labelled. I don't want Muslims claiming religious persecution, this is a biggie with the PC set, which is every western government in the world.

  17. aDCBeast
    December 13, 2009 at 7:19 am

    Wow a dipsh*t Christian trying to tell us about Islam. LOL!

  18. December 13, 2009 at 9:23 am

    islam is more than violent or incompatible…

    it is evil.. and muslims ignorantly worship allah the false illah who actually is satan!!!

    with a false prophet named muhammad who is nothing more than a pedophile, robber, murderer, rapist. oppressor of women. liar..

    if muslims say God is allah…. tell them allah is satan and not God….

    1. The Christian God does not lie…
    King James Bible Luke 21:23 Heaven and earth shall pass away: but my words shall not pass away…

    a: muslim worshipped allah is a deceiver…
    Sura 3:54 "Allah deceived and Allah is the best of deceivers"

    muslims are too ignorant (thanks to muslim thugs who force other muslims to worship that false illah or false god..

    know why?

    Bukhari:V4B52N260 "The Prophet said, 'If a Muslim discards his religion, kill him.'"

    islam's goal..

    Qur'an 8:39 "Wage war on non-muslims and kill them until they submit and the only religion is Islam."

    more?

    goto http://www.liveleak.com

    type in islam….

  19. aDCBeast
    December 13, 2009 at 7:21 am

    Christianity doesn't work. It

    corrupts the minds of all those who let themselves be controlled by other men.

    • December 13, 2009 at 7:26 am

      The video is not about pushing Christianity. So about sticking to the issue at hand?

  20. Excalibur
    December 13, 2009 at 7:19 pm

    Islam is a cult , a destructive malignant entity , which has made religious dogma of it's Prophets psychotic shortcomings . It's Ethos is more destructive than that of the Third Reich , it's goal is world subjugation to Islam , ultimately a decision is offered , REVERT OR DIE .
    Muslims are afraid to look at the life of their own prophet as it was recorded by his own companions.
    Yes the TRUTH is Islam's greatest enemy.
    And the behavior of muslims around the globe , confirms that all criticism made against it are not only true but utterly self evident .
    Indeed the recorded behavior of "the prophet " himself is a glaring indictment against this cult .

  21. Excalibur
    December 13, 2009 at 7:44 pm

    Cair is nothing more than a FRONT ORGANIZATION for the Muslim Brotherhood , whose avowed goal is to DESTROY THE UNITED STATES FROM WITHIN . They have made this no secret , and those who claim otherwise are either IGNORANT DUPES , or CO-COLLABORATORS .
    Any apologetics on behalf of islam are at best , attempts at deception with an agenda , or the babble out of the mouths of ignorant fools , who have absolutely no understanding of the ultimate aims and goals of islam…and the means by which they are prepared, and indeed are engaged in , to accomplish them .

    • December 14, 2009 at 2:46 am

      Russia has the Muslim Brotherhood listed as a terrorist organization. We should do the same and ban all of their tentacles here.

  22. Excalibur
    December 13, 2009 at 7:50 pm

    The "battle for Britain " has already been lost …any battle now , would be to accomplish it's LIBERATION .
    What the British have been thinking in the past 20 or so years to present …..one can only imagine .

  23. Nnacy
    December 13, 2009 at 8:21 pm

    Here is the Mohammed prophet Muslims follow.he orders a mother of 5 children murdered as she slept bed with her child..

    From Muslim Historians.

    Ishaq: 676 You obey a stranger who encourages you to murder for booty. You are greedy men. Is there no honor among you? Upon hearing those lines Muhammad said, Will no one rid me of this woman? Umayr, a zealous Muslim, decided to execute the Prophets wishes. That very night he crept into the writers home while she lay sleeping surrounded by her young children. There was one at her breast. Umayr removed the suckling babe and then plunged his sword into the poet. The next morning in the mosque, Muhammad, who was aware of the assassination, said, You have helped Allah and His Apostle. Umayr said, She had five sons; should I feel guilty? No, the Prophet answered. Killing her was as meaningless as two goats butting heads.

    • December 14, 2009 at 2:45 am

      Thanks Nancy.

    • Len Powder
      December 14, 2009 at 6:03 am

      Umayr felt remorse at the dastardly deed he had just commited. When God created us He breathed a conscience into our minds. However, we have the ability to deaden it, as the Prophet was able to do, not only to his own mind, but to those of his deluded followers. How is Mohammed any different than Stalin or Hitler or Pot Pol, to whom human life was the equivalent of "two goats butting heads"? Answer: No difference at all!

  24. Dan
    December 14, 2009 at 2:18 am

    You make the distinction between Muslims and non Muslims and those who value freedom and those who do not. There is no such distinction. Muslims don't value freedom and non-Muslims certainly do. I will continue to challenge anyone who tries to use their own particular brand of religion as their chief weapon against Islam because of the reasons I have stated in earlier posts. All non Muslims of every stripe need to unite against Islam not because of it's religious element, but because of the tyrannical, totalitarian, authoritarian, freedom stripping nature of it's political manifesto.

    • December 14, 2009 at 2:25 am

      All you continue to do is divide and annoy. Christians are not going to unite with you and your hate of their religion. I don't blame them one bit.

      They funny part is that no one even did what you claim and you acted the fool by attacking Rev. Graham for no other reason then him being a Christian.

    • December 14, 2009 at 6:21 am

      What, you do not 'resent' Christianity and religion in general? You don't hate Christians particularly now F.Graham? You blame religion for, well just about everything. And what does all this have to do with someone making comment on islam irrespective of his personal beliefs? I don't know, it's your tangent, but like a typical naive dolt you're asking me, an atheist for proof of the existence of god. How naive can you get? Now point out to me where Graham made any comparisons and countered the argument with his own religious view? You cannot because your bigoted view cannot get past the fact that religion for those who believe in it provides them with a feeling of contentment and hope that nothing else in this world provides…

      • December 14, 2009 at 6:29 am

        Dan is the great divider. I don't care what people worship or not, just keep it to yourself. Unfortunately that will not happen with the Islamic community.

        • December 14, 2009 at 6:44 am

          There's nothing great about Dan, there are plenty of these types hanging around like bad smells and take note, Dan is against everything and stands for nothing, his fascist tendencies are there for all to see…

    • eib
      December 4, 2011 at 5:49 am

      The problem is not that Muslims don’t value freedom. They define it differently. For them freedom means the freedom to conquer, enslave, terrorize, humiliate, plunder and kill.
      If you look at the behavior of Muslim mobs in Egypt and compare it with the behavior of individual Muslims who drive cars into infidels, rape infidel women, try to destroy infidel businesses, you know just how Islam defines freedom.
      And it is their freedom we must invalidate, it is their honor they must discredit, and it is their ideology that we must oppose every single day.

  25. Nick
    December 13, 2009 at 10:16 pm

    If I can just clarify that – and you’ll have to excuse me because it’s nearly 5am right now – you seem to be of the view that different groups of Christians and atheists should gather together under a “super-banner” against Islam.

    The owner of the website is arguing that there are now Christian groups forming together for this purpose. All right then.

    I put it to you that there are no atheist groups doing so. In fact if you try to unite atheists under an “atheists against Islam” banner, you will find that many of them are obsessed with PC thinking, and are as determined as the most devout Muslim to undermine, or prevent, any genuine criticism of Islam. Oh, they’ll go after Christians all day long. No problem there. But unite atheists against Islam? That’s a joke!

    Richard Dawkins is perhaps the most famous atheist in the world today, and if you visit his website and read the comments of the people who frequent his site, you’ll see what I mean.

    I put it to you that as Christians organise themselves against Islam, instead of telling them they’re getting it all wrong, you ought to realise that they’re doing something your fellow atheists have failed to do.

    If you really want to make a difference, then you ought to spend time amongst your fellow atheists, and strive to get them united against Islam.

    If you can’t get your fellow atheists united amongst themselves, then you certainly aren’t going to get them united under a “super-banner” of any kind.

    So first things first. Before you come over here and criticise someone else for doing something which you and your fellow atheists have not done, I suggest you get your own house in order.

    Good luck with that btw. Really. You’ll need it.

  26. The Infidel Alliance
    December 14, 2009 at 11:10 am

    Here's the simplest way to understand Islam:

    ISLAM'S PRIME DIRECTIVE-THE VIOLENT DOMINATION OF THE ENTIRE WORLD & THE SUBJUGATION OF ALL HUMANITY:
    Bukhari (8:387) – Allah's Apostle Muhammed said, "I have been ordered to fight the people till they say: 'None has the right to be worshipped but Allah' "

    ISLAM'S METHOD-"JIHAD / HOLY WAR":
    Koran (61:4) – "Surely Allah loves those who fight in His way"
    Koran (2:216) – "Fighting is prescribed for you & ye dislike it. But it is possible that ye dislike a thing which is good for you & that ye love a thing which is bad for you. But Allah knoweth & ye know not."

    ISLAM'S PREFERRED METHOD OF JIHAD – TERROR:
    Koran (8:12) – “I will cast terror into the hearts of those who disbelieve. Therefore strike off their heads & strike off every fingertip of them”
    Bukhari (52:220) – Allah’s Apostle Muhammed said… ‘I have been made victorious with terror’

    ~ The Infidel Alliance

    • December 14, 2009 at 4:22 pm

      The message is clear to anyone who is willing to face the truth.
      Thanks for providing this info and keep up the good work!

  27. The Infidel Alliance
    December 14, 2009 at 11:30 am

    We must understand we are not in a "war on Terror". The truth is we are in nothing less than an ISLAMIC WORLD WAR. Let’s look at the facts:

    Islam against the:
    – Catholics in the Philippines
    – Christians in Indonesia
    – Buddhists in Thailand
    – Hindus & Sikhs in India
    – Zoroastrians & Baha’i in Iran
    – Chaldean Christians in Iraq
    – Jews in Israel, Yemen, Mumbai
    – Coptic Christians in Egypt
    – Christians & animists in Sudan
    – Christians in Kenya
    – Christians in Nigeria
    – athiests in Europe
    – Twin Tower office workers in N.Y. (blown up – twice)
    – Army/Navy military recruiters in Little Rock
    – Soldiers in F.t Hood Texas
    – Journalists like Daniel Pearl (savagely decapitated)
    – Jewish centers in Seattle & TorontoAnd on, and on, and on……….

    It is Islam against everyone, everything, everywhere that is not Islamic.

    It is Dar al-Islam against Dar al-Harb. Them against us, not us against them.

    THE ISLAMIC WORLD WAR – it's real.

    ~ The Infidel Alliance

  28. Excalibur
    December 14, 2009 at 12:14 pm

    Indeed , you have put your finger on THE EXACT TRUTH about islam .
    Terror is in fact , described as a usefull tool of islam , approved in any of it's forms, so long as it ultimately benefits the umma [world body of muslims] .
    When muslims say they do not murder the innocent , one must investigate , just who , they consider "innocent " ……ANY infidel is NOT deemed "innocent "
    Atheists should drop their smug attitude of " being above it all " as they are not members of any religion …for in islam , they are simply kuffar , just as ANY other non-muslim . And the past is no excuse for generalizing all the worlds religion .
    We are in the here and now , and there is no other cult or religion whose aims and goals , as well as the means by which they are prepared to achieve them , compare in any small or large way to that which is islam .

  29. Excalibur
    December 14, 2009 at 12:20 pm

    Islam is anti-thetical to humanity itself . It ias encumbent to all muslims to strive [struggle ] -[jihad ] for he Goal of the Prophet , by any means necessarry , and that goal is world subjugation to islam .
    Any obstacle standing in the way of this goal is considered "unjust " .
    – the removal of such obstacles by any means , is considered "justice .

    Ergo , suicide bombing , the killing of innocents , even the slaughter of other muslims is considered justice , and those muslims slaughtered considered "martyrs " .

  30. Bob W.
    December 14, 2009 at 4:53 pm

    Islam is arabic for "submission" and submit is what they demand from their followers and their enemies and of course their wives. It is a very legalistic system, with a very remote god who has no mercy.

  31. The Infidel Alliance
    December 14, 2009 at 11:16 am

    If one reads the Koran, Ahadith, Sunnah & Sira, one will quickly realize Muhammed was not a 'holy phophet'.

    The hard truth is Muhammed was a sadistic sociopath, a murderer, a slaver, a decapitator, a mutilator, an amputator, a looting thief, a rapist, a sex trafficker, a child rapist, a sexual deviant, a kidnapper, a genocidist and a self proclaimed terrorist, motivated by lust, greed and power.

    Far from being a 'holy prophet', Muhammed was perhaps one of the most vile men in the pantheon of human history. Yet it is Muhammed who set the moral foundation for Islam and for all Muslims to emulate.

    Is there any surprise as to why Islam is so violent?

    ~ The Infidel Alliance

  32. Jeffry Poke
    December 3, 2011 at 6:37 pm

    This is an interesting development Claire, thanks for sharing. I agree there is huge upside potential for businesses to harness the spending power of women in their communities. I will follow this case with interest and look forward to an update on how WalMart goes with this. Thanks for sharing!

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